The Global Re-Ordering: Klopp's DFB Mandate, Bezos at Anfield & Europe's Volatile Summer

Welcome to the Total Soccer Show! This is the Bulletin, our news roundup of all the biggest stories in the beautiful game. Today we're talking about what's happening at Liverpool right now. We discuss one of their former employees, Mr. Jürgen Klopp and his new job. And we look at who's next in line for the Italy national team gig. And so, so much more, so, so much more. My name's Ryan Bailey. Joining me today, Taylor Rockwells here. Hi, Taylor. How are you? I'm doing well, Ryan Bailey. Have you thrown your hat in the ring? I know you're missing Italy. I know you'd love to go back. Italy national team manager. Ryan Bailey, a match made in heaven. Sorry, I'm affiliated with a Russian betting site. Taylor, I can't do that. I'm sorry. Sorry, soft cut. Just one. Just one that you know about. Yeah. Yeah. The press conference would be only slightly less combative than Jürgen Klopp's first press conference is Jürgen manager. Here's everything you're doing wrong. Coffee. Pizza. Go great. Actually, I'd like to see it. Let's make it happen. I've already written this page. Graham Ruslan. Hello, how are you? I'm good. Ryan Bailey. Good to be back. I believe you were off last week as well. I'm attending to Taylor and Jürgen that we were sitting in the woodland sauna at center backs together last week. We'll keep that going for a while. That's right. So, dear list, Graham and I both went to a holiday park called center parks last week. But we went to different ones. Graham loves it very much there. Graham's family love going to center parks. He can slightly in Gendoli likes to be still likes coming down over the border to use our holiday parks. Don't you Graham? Pocracy. Yeah, that's because there's not one in Scotland. So, I don't really have much of a choice. So, very good. Taylor, I think we've covered this before, but center parks is kind of like a great wolf lodge kind of situation. Family in the forest. That kind of deal. Rabbits. Dear school. But you're actually in the forest, right? Great wolf lodge feels very enclosed. So, the center parks you're actually outdoors, even if you two don't want to be outdoors. So, we, and on the car journey down to center parks, we were talking in the car, you know, it's a five hour journey. So, you do all kinds of kinds of nonsense. What was each of us looking forward to? And I said a barbecue got to center parks. And because it is the middle of a heat wave right now in England and the UK got to the forest. Big signs. No barbecues. So, that was, that was terrific. But yes, it is very much outdoors. A lot of, a lot of VJ for you then. What did you do instead? Just, just ramen noodles. Yeah. No, there's restaurants and stuff there. There's a Starbucks there. That's why Ryan likes it. There's actually multiple Starbucks. There's a Starbucks in the pool, which is insane. Yeah. The best kind. The best kind. Blackjack in the pool, Starbucks in the pool. My favorite pool activity is grab. I do love that you say that you do all kinds of crazy things on a car journey, like talking to each other. That's quite out there for you. I imagine. I know. In between tablet time. Watch this. I have SpongeBob. Very good. All right, listen to this. We've got a bulletin episode coming up. As we mentioned at the top, we're going to talk about Jürgen Klopp and his new role as Germany manager. We're going to see what's going on at Liverpool. Lots of moving and shaking happening there. And the Italy job. Who wants it? Nobody. Let's find out later on in this episode. Before we get there, patreon.com slash total soccer show is our bonus feed. It is the very best way to support our endeavor. You'll get bonus episode. I think we're going to do some AMAs a little later on on the bonus feed. We're going to do some bonus video, of course, and the crown jewel of our bonus feed. The access to our discord server. All the cool kids are hanging out. Do come and check it out. Thank you to everybody who's there already. patreon.com slash total soccer show. And of course, there's plenty going on on the main feed this week as well. Mr. Joseph Lowry. It's his turn to have a little VK this week. But the three of them here will be with you for the most part with transfer talk. Listen to questions. All that good stuff coming later down the pipeline this week. Yeah, and we should clarify, there's been so much transfer news that feels a little bit awkward to do a bulletin episode and not talk about all the chaos that is unfolding on David Ornstein's social media feeds these last few days. We're going to save that for Wednesday show. So, yeah, stay tuned for that because I genuinely can't wait for that episode. There's so many stories to talk about and so many big transfers that seem like have a good chance of happening. Arsenal fans, Wednesday's episode. This is the one for you. That could be exciting. Oh, boy. Very good. June in then. And keep listening, Arsenal fans. But right now, we're going to talk about the Travago guy. Travago, guys, got a new job. Congratulations to the Jürgen Club. A four-year deal to manage Demand Shuffed, which is going to see him through the 2030 World Cup. That's his first international role. And as Graham, you mentioned, started up in his first press conference by threatening to quit immediately, which is an unusual way of going about things. Yeah, it certainly was an interesting opening press conference where Klopp, I think he tried to set out some boundaries for the German media, who he clearly feels worked too harsh on Julian Nagzmann. He said, yeah, well, I'm going to get on to that. It's the hot dog meme. It's the hot dog meme. It's the hot dog meme. It's the wrongson hot dog meme. But he said, quote, if they don't want me anymore or quote, if they don't leave my family in peace, he will be gone. A very combative way to start a new job. And as Taylor can her references or hints at. Pretty ironic considering he was this lingering specter over Nagzmann for the entire World Cup, literally standing on the touch line for Germany games. He was a pundit for Magenta TV, which I believe were the rights holders in Germany for the World Cup. And it was, at multiple points, his criticism of the team that really hit the hardest. And there was a, in particular, Seb Stafford Blur has a really good, sort of deep diivarical for the athletic. On how this appointment has been in Seb's words 20 years in the making for Klopp and how it came to be over the summer. And he details one particular piece of criticism where Klopp left off for now hanging in one of his quotes about Nagzmann. He's picking the team for now. And as everyone was already linking him with a national team job, that was then used as a stick to beat Nagzmann with. And a lot of his criticisms set the tone for the way that the tournament was, was analysed as obviously Germany crashed out pretty early in that competition to Paraguay. So it was certainly a choice for a Jürgen Klopp to start like this. But I guess he knows the power that he has. This always felt like the appointment for Germany. They were going to go nowhere else other than Jürgen Klopp. It was their first protocol. And I have to say there's something about it that feels right. Keep in mind this is only his fourth managerial job in his entire career. He's been mine's manager, don't manager, Liverpool manager and now Germany manager. And he and at each point of his career has been very careful over the next move that he's he's made. So he surely had a lot of time to think about this. And it's going to be really interesting to see how it all works out. Okay, we just really get to dismiss all of his hard work as Red Bull's head of global soccer and all of the obvious work and improvement he made in that regard. It seems like no, it is entirely sure what that job entailed or what he was doing aside from publicly being Jürgen Klopp associated with RB and that's maybe getting players' design and getting more spotlight on the on the teams. But aside from that, I'm not really sure what he was doing over there. I think Seb Stafford Blurin, that piece called him Dr. Red Bull's Dr. Football and that actually nobody could really pin down what his, I mean, he was an ambassador, right, for Red Bull. They saw an opportunity to make like a big splashy signing quote and quote. And I think Jürgen Klopp was quite happy to cash those checks from his villa in Mallorca. That's well, even though it's an international job, he'll be more involved in actual soccer here. Graham, I wouldn't suggest that Red Bull just hand out doctorates willy-nilly like that. I'm sure he earned it. The University of Red Bull is like the X games, you have to drive an F1 car, there's a whole load of things, you have to fly with wings. It's actually one of the more difficult doctorates to get. Yeah, the full doctorate has been you jump out of a plane without a parachute and then you have to catch up to it midair. It's a risky thing, but Klopp went for it and did it. And now he can move on to potentially greener pastures. I thought that that piece, Graham, was really informative in kind of highlighting how obvious the Klopp appointment became as like the tournament went on as the World Cup went on and Germany eventually crashed out. And one of the ones that really stood out to me was the point about like as they were limited by Paraguay, you get the camera cut to Nagel's Ben like sitting in the dugout just looking completely for Lauren and confused and unsure of what's gone wrong. And then the next cut is to Klopp in it like doing his analysis, talking about what's gone wrong, giving this kind of impassioned speech about like what needs to change and the mentality of the team, but kind of avoiding mentality, obviously focusing on analytics and performance. But still it's just there's this obvious juxtaposition right away of a younger coach in Nagel's Ben who maybe doesn't have that kind of pedigree yet is very famous was seen as a coup at the time of like getting this guy to come in and coach Germany, but it hasn't really clicked. It hasn't really clicked in the media certainly. And by contrast, you have Klopp who is in his like full or a persona like coming out explaining what's going wrong. Kind of offering solutions. And now it seems like that will be his job. He's going to select the players. He's obviously going to you know, choose the lineups and the tactics. But more than that, it seems like it will be a full audit of German football. The issues on display. The reasons for why they've struggled so much so recently. A lot of it looks like seems to be about like top end talent development as well as youth development behind it. So you know, no small feat to turn around that entire country. It's been done before though. So maybe Klopp will do it again. Yeah, as indeed, Taylor, what's a what's a reasonable expectation do you think for young Klopp in the next few years? His first game in charge is going to be at the end of September against the Netherlands in the nation's league. Germany Netherlands is quite the introduction to a job, I would say. Pretty big rivalry there. But obviously we're looking ahead to 2030 here. What's what's reasonable? Gang passed around of 64, around 128. I'm not sure what we're doing in 2030. But presumably it will be to make a deep run final four kind of thing. I mean, you would assume, right? And you say the goal was 2030. It might be like with a pit stop in 2028 in the euros. And I think largely though, he's going to have a lot of runway to kind of do whatever he wants. I don't think there's going to be an insane amount of patience for him. But given the way Germany got knocked out, given the way they performed at the other most recent World Cups, it does feel like there is an idea here that it's not maybe a full-dust reboot, but you're not far from it. And so I think results are going to fall by the wayside a little bit if that's even possible for Germany. I think it will be about making sure that the entire pool is sort of searched and gone through and figuring out where the depth and talent truly is. But then also where the areas might be that need to be improved. And I think a lot of that relates to, as I said, top end talent and youth development. Multiple other German internationals passed in present. I mean, I guess all of them passed at this point, but like Tony Cruz during the World Cup talking about Germany not having a single world class player. We have players with world class potential, but it's a long way from saying that they are world class. And that's a valid point in my mind that German squad was was very good, especially by international standards. But then you look at it up against the true like titans of international football. And it's not close and there's so many areas of deficiency in need. Some of those are nogosman squad selection preferences. But even the players that he left off were sort of younger players without much of a pedigree or without much experience. Didle Roy son I need to start every single game. I don't know. Didle Younger. It's good need to take up a roster spot. I don't know. But it does speak to a lack of kind of that top end world class talent. Yeah. And that's not something you fix by September or October. So it does feel like it's going to be a long path building towards 2030. And maybe 20, 28 and the euros being an opportunity to see where the progress has been and what still needs to happen. Yeah, and we've just come out of a world cup where we had several big name managers who were hired to elevate the level of large like maybe with the exception of Tuko. And but certainly in the case of pop scene with the USA and Ancelotti with with Brazil. They were hired to elevate the level of a team that maybe wasn't quite among that sort of tier one nations. And they weren't ultimately weren't able to do it. So this is going to be I think this is a really challenging job for your club. I think it's the most challenging job of his entire career. And I think what makes this there's there's two sides of this. Yes, there's the player side of things. I think we would all agree that Germany have been better than they've shown in the last few tournaments. Like they should still have had the talent to get past Paraguay. They were also very unfortunate to run into Spain in the quarterfinals in the last euros. They might have gone further had that had that not happened because until that point they've been pretty impressive. So there is some nuance required when assessing this group of German players keep in mind. They've got the starting center forward for the Premier League champions and Kai Heverts. They've got Jamal Moussiala. They've got Florian Virts. So there's still quite a lot of talent to work with it within this squad. But it's it's also not a vintage German team. It feels like they're low ebbs since like the early 2000s, which as Taylor mentioned, like that reboot, I think is a fair comparison. The other side of what makes this job so challenging is the politics of it. I think you know within German football former players and managers seem to have they all seem to have an opinion. They all seem to have prominent TV roles or prominent executive roles. And their opinion carries real weight, real weight. And we see there's a lot of overlap with biomunic, right? This is a big big thing with biomunic is the politics of that job or a real challenge. And then you factor in the level of expectation that might not be realistic for a club in this job. I think clubs got a lot to wrestle with with this German job. And ultimately some nuance might be required to assess the impact that he's he's able to make. Obviously there's we speak all the time about how in an international soccer, you're not able to have the intricate. You just don't have the time on the training field to have the intricate kind of systems and so on. That might be something that holds him back. I think vibes wise, you know, clop as a guy who's all about belief and building players up. And that might that might work quite well for an international soccer. But I just don't know of Germany or in a place to win these these euros and world cups. And ultimately that'll be I suppose what you'll what you'll be judged on. I also think he's going to want to build up Graham totally totally agree with that. And that is a thing that he has done really well at every club gig so far. But part of that building up process as I understand it is conflict and it is sort of tearing down. And it is going at players and seeing how they respond to adversity and to criticism and to challenge. And do they kind of raise their game? Do they make adjustments? Do they listen to instruction or do they kind of stick with the way they've been playing or with that mentality? Do that's when players tend to be moved on. That's harder to do at international level. And I'm fascinated how he kind of employs that approach if he does. But I think he will because I think we've already seen it happen with that introductory press conference. I think some managers would go into that being like I'm the media darling now everybody loves me. Everybody wants me to have this job. And I'm no fool like I know it's going to come with criticism and and a lot of work and a lot of spotlight. And the people who are going to be shining that spotlight on me are in this room. So I'm going to be really cordial with them and really friendly and sort of try to establish a good working relationship where they want to write nice things about me. I say nice things to them. And that can work but it can also like give the perception of weakness on occasion. And I think it can invite a familiarity that can quickly turn to contempt and criticism. And it feels like he has gone the other way and and come out and been immediately sort of conflict oriented immediately laying down lines establishing boundaries and good on him for it. But there's a part of me that's like leave my family out of it. It feels like yeah, that's that's a fair thing to say. Did they go after Nogel's been family? Is that a thing that happened? Like maybe that's happened to other coaches. Maybe that's exactly exactly that's the one. The world board community. You just have to really hard turn the world up. It's just there. They're they're an organization non-grata at this point with German football and Bayern Munich. It just felt to me like a person coming out and basically being like we were friends. But now we're on opposite sides and you have to prove like like I just it's an immediate way to I think establish a little bit of control over the situation by using that kind of fiery personality that we know he has. So I think he's kind of already playing the game and giving the system a little bit having worked his way into the good graces of the German population of the media even more so during this summer. Yeah, I think it was a smart start Taylor and also the cynic in me thinks he's given himself thinks that he has gotten easy out I would say. Because if he does the metric by which he decides clop out is kind of not really well established here. If he sees a bit criticism in the press he could decide there's a that's it I'm done. I'm going back to my back to smoke in my in my villa now. It's not one or two though Ryan. It's all of them. He is that he clarified that he was like if you all think not one or two of you but all of you think that I'm doing a bad job. So it's that particular presser if all of those journalists come together to say no then he's out. He's he's sending like a serving monkey email round to the media that decides whether it continues. All right. Well, from one national team that's looking to do a little bit better to another Italy. Pep Guardiola apparently spoke with the Italian F.A. As did Carlo Ancelotti. The Italian F.A. has not landed either of those options. They looked like they were going to land their third choice. Andrea Pillo who has confirmed as we were called on this Monday that he's no longer in the line to coach the Italian national team. Because he has a sponsorship deal with a Russian betting firm called Font Bet. And to be clear here the issue isn't the betting itself. It is Italy's support for Ukraine in the war against Russia. So Pillo has made some statements sort of in his defense about this as well. But Graham what are we making of the Italy job scenario at the moment? Yeah, I mean this is a story that has has burned very brightly for the past couple of weeks and has burned in a load of different ways where it was about Pep Guardiola. Initially where it was widely reported that the Italian Federation had spoken to Guardiola about taking over as Italy manager. This was confirmed by Palo Maldini who is the new technical director of the Italian Association. Obviously has been in that role at AC Milan. I think AC Milan fans actually rated him pretty highly. I'm not entirely sure why they moved on from him. But anyway, he's the new guy plotting a route forward for Italy. And he also said as you can a reference round that they've spoken to Carlo Ancelotti. I think he offered that up himself. I don't think that had even been reported. And the reasoning he gave was they wanted to gauge whether the best managers in the world would be interested in the Italy job. Alas, they're not. And Guardiola turned them down pretty quickly. And Ancelotti, I presume turned them down as well. This is a complete mess now. Because the Russian thing seems to be what obscured Pirolo taking over. Should also have been a factor. Pirolo's managerial record is very terrible. So not convinced that would have been a great appointment. So I don't really know where Ryan. Have you seen any names like alternative names being linked? Taylor, have you seen anything? Because I think seems like Italy already out of ideas. Mencini and Conte. All right. Okay, just come back to that well again. Mm-hmm. And that has been, like, for Italians, I'm assuming the very frustrating kind of aspect of this story has been your linked sort of with Guardiola and Ancelotti. Because I think you have to kind of pursue them. You have to just have a word and see if there's any possibility. But then it's Pirolo and then it's Conte and then it's Mencini. And I think this is at a time when there has been a slight reckoning with Italian football. And I'm feeling that like something has to change. We have to look at what we're doing. We have to examine our processes. And then I think to kind of go with familiar names, one of whom, to Graham's point, doesn't have a great manager or record. Feel sort of like you're kind of doing the same things and hoping that things are going to turn out differently. And I don't know if they would have. So on some level, I think that the Pirolo criticism of these connections to Russia and the Russian betting firm and doing kind of PR and propaganda for Russia, depending on your perspective. Like I think that's all valid criticism. I'm not sure it's the reason why Pirolo hasn't gotten this job in the end. I think a lot of it is probably a feeling that like we're not really sure what the best way forward is. There's lots of kind of voices, loudly suggesting answers, but not really like one voice that's rising to the top. And so I think instead we are getting this sort of mixture of like maybe it's one of the most famous managers in the world. Maybe it's somebody who did it before and can maybe do it again. Maybe it's a national team legend. I don't know, maybe they'll go like the Bosnia route at a point, a media persona to see if they could do it better. Who knows, but it does feel very murky right now at a time football. Yeah, they should probably take a minute to work out what the next route is because otherwise it just feels like they're flailing from one thing to the next. I actually, despite the fact I sort of mocked them going for a gradual look, that was worth a shot. That was the right move to ask them the question. And I kind of taught myself into maybe, maybe God do will take this job. There's a lot of upside, right? Even if you're the guy who takes Italy back to the world cup, you're going to be, you're going to have some reverence. In a football mad nation that is similar to Germany, like I know they're sort of in the doldrums at the moment. This isn't a vintage Italian team. They're still better than they have shown. And they won a Euros. And amongst this run of not qualifying for World Cups, they've still won a major tournament. So we're talking about a nation and a team that still has per degree. You obviously had likes to, it was Brescia, right, that he played for in Italy back in the day. And it feels likely that his next job, Guardiola, will be an international manager job. So I kind of talked myself into maybe, I remember we had a discussion not so long ago about, not so long ago about Guardiola. We wanted him to take like an MLS job or somewhere where it wasn't guaranteed. And I'd kind of talk myself into Italy being his version of that. I'll ask it's not going to happen. But I don't really know where to go after this point. They should probably, you can say there's some things. Just stop. Easy to lead. Like maybe not for you all, certainly not for Ryan. I'll ask this question to Graham with that in mind. Graham, like my assumption is that Italy still has like a little bit of the England about them. Of like, but we're still we're Italian football. Like we've won the World Cup so many times. We know what we're doing. So it feels like it's a really difficult position for them because at this point with the way the federation is being run with the quality of player they have with the lack of results. It isn't a top tier job. So it's harder to pull in like a top tier manager. But I think there is still a pride in Italian football that would not allow them to go for like an experimental manager. They're not going for like Moriasu from Japan. They're not going to try to roll the dice with somebody because I feel like almost that would be seen as like we're bringing in somebody who doesn't know as much about football as we do. Why would we ever do that? So it seems like they're in a difficult position of they want a world class manager, a name manager. But they're not really in a position where they can actually get that. And so it feels like it ends up being a lot of the kind of retreads and coaches that are familiar to all of us. I think the pride point is entirely valid Taylor and going for pure lore, content or Mancini it basically is just they're allowed to it gives themselves the allowance to say well we're going for the best of Italian right and we want an Italian manager. They've kind of let their guard down a little bit by going for Guardiola but still they can argue well we went for the goal right we went for the absolute the absolute best. If they bring their standards down a little bit and that job still isn't attractive to like the tier two managers if they go to like a. I'm struggling to even think of a name Roberto Martinez right he's he's doing another job that he doesn't deserve and he turns them down but that's that's hugely embarrassing so I kind of do anticipate them going for another one of the. The musical chair Sarriallo have they ever had a non Italian manager like I think I think they had Elenio Herrera in the 60s maybe is like an interim but I'm not sure that counts because he's obviously like has the strong interconnections I can't think of a time they've ever had a non Italian manager so even if they went the ways they've been going or been rumored to be going that in and of itself is kind of a break with tradition. Elenio Herrera in 1966 as they're only for a manager. I remember that from our inter from our inter profile of that time period. Very good well done whoever is though they're going to have to like know that oh I was 17th on the list and when they gave this job that might be something to take. And how how far off the roundabout Italian soccer managers are they going to go at this point like is it going to be like well Chris Pratt did play Mario in the movie let's ask him now like what where do we go from. He's doing a lot of other stuff and doing I mean that would be that would be it a group like he's doing a lot of stuff it doesn't any of it seem to really be working or resonating with audiences and hasn't really led to a lot of success. But he keeps succeeding so that does feel like an Italian manager in a certain sort of yeah. And he never turns down a job so they don't have to be worried about that. Yeah mouse brat were huge in Italy all right let's let's take a quick break when we come back we're going to talk about Liverpool what's been happening over their summer join us then. Total soccer show welcome back to the bulletin let's turn our attention to mercy side and Liverpool who are priming themselves for a new season. Now is talks of apparently Jeff Bezos maybe even joining the ownership groups who I did their brand little joke for that yeah like that good I got it yeah. So grand lot of stuff happening up to off the field with Liverpool let's sum it up for us would you. Yeah I mean I'm finding Liverpool summer fascinating because on one front not a lot has happened in terms of their summer transfer business it hasn't really kicked into top gear yet. And yet there is so much happening behind the scenes I can't really this segment is just what's going on with Liverpool right now because there's not really a single headline so run through some of the stuff that's that's happened so first of all Michael Edwards is gone again he left as F.S.G.s sporting director earlier this month for anyone who doesn't know who Michael Edwards is he was widely credited as the sort of transfers in data guru who masterminded a lot of the clock era he then left. In twenty twenty three then returned in twenty twenty four in this sort of expanded role as basically the the heads of them then we sports groups football department. At the time when they had plans to create a multi club group they then ditch those plans and it wasn't really clear what Edward roll was when Liverpool went out and got another sporting director for the club in the form of Richard Hughes so Edwards is now gone. Also uncertainty around Richard Hughes is future he's been very strongly liked with a job in the Saudi pro league the athletic reports that he's expected to leave next summer so there's all that uncertainty as well then you have the reports of as you can reference Ryan a possible takeover takeover or at least investment in Liverpool by new investors including Jeff Bezos who is spoken to a consortium who are putting together an offer apparently it's 30% of the club that this consortium is is looking to buy which is really significant it's not a full takeover. But for context that is more than Jim Ratcliffe owns of Manchester United so that that's a significant arrival of of new investors to Liverpool if it comes to pass. And then you have the and Tony Areola of it all where he is talking about keep in mind a new manager first of all for Liverpool and he's talking about how thin his squad is especially in the defensive positions and that was before Joe Gomez got a bad injury in a preseason game against Sunderland and Nashville over the weekend. The two deals that they have completed one is Jeremy Jackie and who's a center back that was done months ago that was just a formality that one getting done once the window opened and then the one legitimate sign and they've made Victor Munoz from also sooner. He is not the Salah replacement or I'll be shocked if he's the Salah replacement I think he is a depth player and they've been linked with Bradley Barcola but Liverpool have been really slow to get going this summer when I think everyone expected them to have much more of a plan and I think it's fair to ask whether some of the off-field stuff is there. Some of the off-field stuff is impacting what they've been able to do on the field. What do you think the plan is Graham if you had to speculate which is always a fair thing to ask of you and not myself because like the Michael Edwards multi club ownership thing that he's brought in to kind of oversee and then get shelved that feels to me. At the very least if she look here out and thinking there's not value for this or we can't be as financially competitive or it doesn't give us the leg up that we wanted. And so like on some level I then see them selling a 30% stake in the club like maybe that is they want more investment to then pursue that but that doesn't make sense why you would then part ways with Michael Edwards or allow him to leave when you're early. Like there's signs in there of like are they are they kind of being like I you know what we can just kind of like make money and run this thing as stable as we need to or is this a move towards a greater financial competitiveness financial flexibility I'm a little confused as to what the plan is with Liverpool and I think there's a lot of factors into that that it felt like slot was the heir apparent was going to be there ideally for a long time as was clop now here we are with new manager new kind of sporting apparatus and sporting directors and potential new ownership and a lack of kind of expansion the way they had targeted it feels like a question mark of a time for Liverpool. Yeah for sure I think that's the way to sum it up it feels like Liverpool for such a long time have been arguably the best run big club in the Premier League maybe even Europe under FSG and it feels like they don't have that sort of guiding light anymore and that's related to all the field stuff it's on the field stuff as well I listened to a anfield rap and podcast recently not the john Barnes it gets me every time when you reference that every time I'm like I mean you're just to find the motivation to be like yeah what does john burn ice have to say about this situation yeah I listen to the anfield rap and just you know it inspires me a bit lower pool football club and I've got things to talk to you about no there's a very I'd recommend them highly they are a fan run and outlet who do articles and podcasts and they're confusion was was was shared by those Liverpool fans who would know much more about it than than than any of us they don't really know what the plan is for Liverpool there was speculated it was raised on that podcast I listened to that maybe this is Liverpool's way of elevating themselves to a level where they can compete with the state owned clubs of Europe the PSG's the Manchester City's I know Liverpool have spent a lot of money on transfers particularly last year when they brought the Premier League transfer record twice and in the one window but still when you look at wages matches or city and PSG are still able to spend much more so bringing an outside investment might help them with that on the field like it's it's it's a lot of a mess for the moment where they've spent such a long time trying to transition into this ball orientated possession heavy team because they believe that's what they need to be in the modern game clop started doing a couple seasons before he left then slot was brought in as a kind of reflection of of that move towards a different style of play and ultimately Liverpool have decided actually the modern game not really moving in that direction we need to roll it back a little bit and they've hired a real house much more transition orientated than slot was and I expect we will see some deals that reflect that rollback it's just those deals haven't happened yet and there are questions over who's actually making the decisions at Liverpool with Richard Hughes is on his way out I mean my this is pure speculation this isn't the athletics reporting I feel like he has already agreed to join someone next year and he is serving his notice and that's why he's basically said I'm leaving at the end of my contract next year it would not surprise me if once this window closes Richard Hughes has gotten and he actually leaves before the end of his contract so who's making the decisions at Liverpool both in the front office and executive level and what what is what are those decisions being guided by I don't think anyone really knows right now. Graham let me ask you this what would allow your fears for Liverpool if what would what would they have done at this point you thought okay the ship is being steered correctly is it a case of the transfers is it what is it for you that gives you the question here. Well if I can give you a micro example of what would make me feel better it would be signing yandio mandy before the world cup started they were very much the club that was leading that pursuit are be lights I wanted a hundred million euros for him Liverpool kind of from everything that I've read by the way that none of this is my information I know nothing I'll I go by David Ornstein and various various various other sources apparently Liverpool wanted to drive that price down and then demand they had an incredible world. And all of a sudden Arby Leipzig are collecting 135 million from Real Madrid for for demand. So if I knew someone at Arby Leipzig like higher. Yes, a doctor football perhaps you know who could have helped get that deal over the light. It felt like demand they had been scouted for such such a long time there was a certainty that he was their salary replacement and now they don't really know what. What they want to do like barcle has been linked but he's going to cost an absolute fortune like a Premier League record fee apparently if they want to get him in he plays on the wrong sides like ultimately he is more comfortable on the left side. That might be similar with demand they but I think he's more I think he's more adaptable he can play either side. So I just think some conviction woods I'd like to see that from Liverpool this summer it doesn't really feel like they know what the what the plan is. On a slice I know do we know what most of us doing at the moment is it going to plans. He's heavily linked with Beshtosh last I saw him and joining up there together that feels like speculation more than reality but who knows. And then exporting KC seem pretty prominent from the MLS side and then I'm assuming Saudi Arabia are also in conversation as are probably a lot of other clubs and I think Joe has made this point before probably just depends on what. What was looking for does he want to be like a passenger on a Champions League team does he want to be the man on a smaller Champions League team or potential Champions League team or does he want to go explore greener pastures in greener and multiple senses of the word. We shot the yeah Taylor are in Leandro Trossards unveiling for Beshtosh I enjoyed the Trossards and the Beshtosh I presume like chief executive or whatever being drowned out by chance of Salah from the fans and attendance it's fun so that's fun for him doesn't he also I guess they'll be on opposite sides so it'd be fine one on the left one on the right they'd be okay. It would be a good attack. Beshtosh would would look pretty good. I don't think I'll tell Sarah I've done much I think Fenerbahce I've done a little bit but it's wide open in the Turkish super league until the officials or the FAA or the government says never mind no it's not. Very good one final thing on Liverpool the investment from reported investment from Jeff Bezos how material do we think this is and how how much of an impact would it have I mean I assume they'd be taking a rocket ship to Champions League games but otherwise maybe. Similar spending to what they have now. It feels less concrete to me than the other bitter which is what Amit Batia the former or the current QPR owner but he's like step back from all QPR operations resigned after being in a variety of roles for them for a long time so it does feel like he is making moves to secure this 30% at I think evaluation of like over 4 billion so his percentage would be 1.35 billion. Largely as I understand it finance by his father-in-law Lakshmi it's all who's a billionaire steel magnate that seems to be the offer that has sparked a lot of this kind of frenzy and it does feel like the offer that is kind of the leading candidate right now and maybe then it's it's FSG looking for other competitors or other kind of billionaires who might want that percentage and obviously Bezos could buy the entirety of Liverpool football club. I don't even know how many times like at least at least 10 like at least 100 I forget where his valuation is but I think he's like 250 billion so you know it's a drop in the bucket for him why not but it seems like there is interest from other parties that is maybe then led to them reaching out to see if Bezos might also be involved either way it seems like there's going to be some level of sale of ownership for several billion dollars. Wonderful love to hear it and I'm sure it's a wonderful I don't know yeah well the QPR thing and the metal sir I mean they've never had a problem with their own ship groups QPR so I think that all sounds good fine nothing worry about that's the real multi-club group they're buying Liverpool to be the feeder team to QPR of course I'm not going to back to London there we go that's what we like I'm saying. I'm saying really hard to be excited about the return of club football like especially after this World Cup which has had its ups and downs obviously but to go straight to like they're like trading horses and billions of dollars spent and will they spend another billion dollars on these players it does sort of feel like oh right the the crash commercialism is even more at the heart of football than international football it's not by a lot but they both have it quite a bit but man just talking about how many times Jeff Bezos could buy Liverpool really did. Do a number on my soul just now I mean at least they're spreading the wealth a little bit it's not just directly funneled into Gianni and Fantino's pocket. So there's that we'll see how that plan of about itself okay let's say one more quick break when we come back we're going to put a smile on Taylor's face we're going to talk about what we're looking forward to from this coming season do join us then total soccer show welcome back to the bulletin we're going to look ahead to the season which starts in. But a few weeks I'm sure in Scotland it's been going for a month or two at this point we're four games deep yeah yeah you are you know you are we look at look forward to what we're looking forward to in these European domestic seasons I'm going to get the ball rolling Graham what I'm looking forward to is Tottenham this new Tottenham season because of the spending that they've done which confuses me quite a bit there's San Dritton Ali has Fernandez Van Hecker I suppose Andy Robertson on a free but they've done loads and loads of investment at this point seems like they want to change half the team and for a team who circled the drain last season their strategy seems to be let's just throw money directly at the issue and I'm very intrigued to see whether that actually pays off what do you think Graham? I mean it's better than not throwing money at the issue which is what Tottenham have done in the past and that hasn't really worked for them. I totally agree though Ryan like there's also the deserving of it all I'm quite high on him as a coach I think there are obviously external things with deserving that are concerning and maybe lead to the idea that he will maybe burn brightly as first manager but not for very long that tends to be how things work for him in the managerial business but they were they're part of one of the things I'm looking forward to Ryan which is just the general uncertainty at the top of the Premier League table this season I was talking about Tottenham Graham just to be clear. Well I don't you know I don't know where these teams are going to finish but I'll say like of the biggest clubs right like the big six plus Villain Newcastle and all those guys. The biggest clubs in the Premier League I think there's very little like there's very little givens are very little guarantees at this point. Arsenal are the only team to really be building on top of a solid foundation. Everyone else is sort of starting from scratch and maybe not starting from scratch in the case of Mariska and Citi obviously he's coming into an established squad but I don't think anyone knows how that's going to go. Citi are continuing their squad renewal with your boy Ryan John Stone's leaving Bernardo Silva's now gone. Rodri could also be leaving more on that and Wednesday's transfer episode I would presume. Manchester United you know they've kept on Michael Carrick that this season feels like he's having to prove himself all over again. They'll have Champions League football to contend with that makes things difficult for their squads they're doing a lot of business as well. We've spoken about Liverpool and everything that's going on there and I am still at Villa but they're going through a pretty big rebuild this summer whether that was the intention or not. It feels like it sounds like some rival clubs got wind of some release clauses that Villa wish hadn't been public knowledge and they're now having to replace those players. And then Chelsea have seriously throwing their lot in with Javi Lanzone a lot of the signings that they're making are clearly geared towards his system. I feel very uncomfortable with the business that Chelsea are doing this summer because I quite like quite like a lot of what they're doing. They're spent a lot of money I don't know if Morgan Rogers is worth 117 million but Morgan Rogers is a good player so ultimately who cares I guess. So yeah everything is sort of up for grabs at the top end of the the Premier League I think that's going to be interesting. They've got time they've got time Graham they'll be a ridiculous signing don't worry give a time Chelsea will still Chelsea themselves. But I agree with you like the Premier League is going to be weird and I'm really excited about it for all the reasons you've already listed. But even when you when you go past like the potential top four top six top eight whatever it is. You've got Pierre Sage taking over Crystal Palace you've got Marco Rosa at Bournemouth you've got Arbolo at Fulham which is still insane to me. Oliver Glasner now at Nottingham Forest and we've got Frank Lampard back in the Premier League coaching Coventry. It's just going to be a strange season with a lot of new faces and then a lot of familiar faces and new environments. Like so I really could go any number of ways for any number of these clubs and I think it is really wide open. It does feel like it should be arsenal and then the pack behind and that probably is how it will look when we do our previews given their stability given our teta given that they are the rating champions. But I still can't shake it I still feel like it's going to be all over the place this season and I doubt we're going to have like one just clear runaway front runner the entire season. I'm hoping I'm wrong and that it is Manchester United obviously but it does seem like it's going to be a pretty tumultuous season with lots of chopping and changing given that we've already seen so much change with so much of the summer still to come. Yeah there you go and Taylor on the man United thing I think it's kind of one of the things I'm looking forward to this season as well because I have underestimated Manchester United last season given how they started the season how they finished it was very much a season of two halves for man United. Because you hate them. That was a given yeah but also I mean tealumins is a good signing it feels like things are shaping up quite nicely for this campaign for Manchester United as well. Do you feel do you feel bullish about this campaign? It's tough to feel bullish about anything Manchester United these days it does seem like carrot has buy in has some level of stability it also seen that way when I'm going to show I was there and then things kind of came off the rails. But carrot does seem to have a strong foundation does seem to have the backing of the board and the ownership does seem to have the buy in from the players has connections to the academy and it does seem like that is continuing to be very. Profitable and helpful way to kind of keep that team fresh to some extent as they look for new acquisitions and I think the new acquisitions they've gone after. Do make a lot of sense Carl Darlo especially anytime you can get another record you got to do it but the tealumins one especially for that price tag even if he is at a more advanced stage. That seems to have opened a lot of speculation that like if they part ways with zirkecy then they're going to go for like all the walkins and apparently now they're just signing 30 year olds Manchester United but the Andre Santos signing as well. Does seem to have like ticked one area of need for them in the center midfield I think there's still several more that need to be filled. But it does seem like there is more stability and consistency there than there has been in some time and it's positive stability and consistency as well so it's like room to grow. There is a foundation there is a blueprint and now we see how they can evolve if they can I think they will and I think it will be a good season. I don't think it's going to be an elite season but I think it will be a strong one. I think there's absolutely no doubt that in terms of the front office side of things Manchester United this is a different club we're seeing. I've been pretty consistent in my faith in Jason Wilcox as much as you can be with a front office person that you don't really know what they do but I think his track records is pretty decent and whenever I hear him speak he seems to be pretty switched on. And I can see a lot of his I can see a lot of his influence and deals at Manchester are going for I feel like in the Edward Ward era they would have paid 100 million for my taste Fernandez they would have paid 120 million for someone else by now and it just feels like they're not they're not being held to ransom by clubs as they were in the past. Unfortunately for them it's coincided with a window with the market seems to have exploded and we're now looking at 100 million as the benchmark for a top level midfielder which they really need three of. I still feel like they need one more I'll make a judgment on the Santos and the Telemann signings once they get that third midfielder in and I can kind of see what the profile of the midfield is because I think they're lacking legs like we spoke about a couple weeks ago in the Patreon. And they've still been they've been like with Carlos Beliba they've been like with whose other one man who coin is the other name that keeps cropping up so they've still got some business to do but I'm with you Ryan I quite like tentatively like what they've done so far. Yeah very good and tell anything else looking forward to this coming campaign. Yeah I mean the rest of the rest of the silly season for sure like like the transfer window is just always fun. It seems to be more fun than it's been at least to me in quite some time because you have I think so much flux in the Premier League it is largely primarily dominated when you look at the top transfers and that's kind of always the case. But it feels like there are clubs that you wouldn't expect to be spending this amount of money spending a ton of money taught them specifically. And then you have man city spending money where they need to to strengthen a team but we've already talked about the managerio issue there but like do they then have to sell more players will they part ways with some people if they're not fitting the system like dido that question for Liverpool and what comes next for them with some of that team. It just feels like we're going to get a lot of players in the shop window becoming the subject of speculation because right now we're still post world cup but those players haven't returned to training camp yet really. Some are I think are going to be joining their teams on preseason tours some are going to be joining after the teams return for like an even more full preseason at home. But all that to say it feels like we haven't even really scratched silly season yet with how many how many deals were done during the world cup we kind of weren't able to focus in on them and it does feel like it's about to ratchet up in the intensity and in the acquisitions and in the expenditure. So I'm excited for all of the randomness and silliness and insanity that comes with a silly season widening to attend. Yeah and and link to the the silly season one club that has engaged in more selling us than than most already in this window is Real Madrid and that's one of the things I'm looking forward to season is Joseph Reno being back at Real Madrid is going to be blockbuster possibly not in a good way for Real Madrid. Almost certainly not a good way. I don't think it's going to work but I'm not a Real Madrid fans so in a sense I don't really care. It's going to be interesting especially with some of the moves that they've made this summer. These are the players that they've signed some of a couple of whom I've forgotten had signed for Real Madrid Bernardo Silva top of that list he signed for Real Madrid. Did we miss that one during the world cup. Denzel Dumfries, Abraham and Camnate. Yandia Mande is going to sign this week it seems and I really want to do. You could really forgot about him. Yeah, there's another one. And Roderay seems like their next big target. So all of a sudden this feels like another galactical summer for Real Madrid. Venetius could be leaving as you know that was another on steam bomb a couple days ago with Arsenal being interested in him. So one way or another Real Madrid are going to be worth watching this this season. Sorry, I just have to ask. Do we think this is going to be good for Arsenal if they were to get Venetius because that feels like an area of obvious need like you've talked forever Graham that they need a stronger left side attacker. That is Venetius but he won't be doing any left side defending and that also seems to be a thing like our tentative would want. I don't know how this would work but it would be fun. Yeah, I mean it's it's a pretty big shift in I don't like profile from Arsenal to get a both off the field and on the field to get that player because Martin Ellie who you know I'm on the record on this show is not is not one of my favorite players. But he does press like he's he is effective from the front line. It's something that he offers that that team and as you say Venetius is maybe not going to not going to do that. But I think if there's a chance to to sign one of the the most proven and most spectacular attacking difference makers in the world. Particularly at this age where Venetius is not old and by any stretch then you you try and get a deal done. So I would like that signing for Arsenal and presume we're going to talk more about it on Wednesday but for the rate from the Real Madrid side of things that they're. As it say like don't know if it's going to be good feels like it could it could be over by the end of September if Reno does marine your things as he tends to do. But it's going to be very interesting will be very interesting indeed and will be very interesting if we see Vinnie in the Premier League doing this some defending stuff. I'm sure he'll take it on the chin anyway let's let's wrap this one up shall we plenty more to come on the feed this week. Thank you very much indeed for your expertise as always. Thank you very much my friend. Thank you very much Grandmother. Thank you very much. And thank you again listener for joining us on this one will be back on the feed very shortly indeed. But for now. Bye. Bye.